Privatized health care is the next shoe to drop

Robin Brentnall

- July 27, 2012 at 12:06:28

This just in (27 July 2012) The federal government's new funding formula for the health-care transfer to the provinces amounts to a $36-billion cut, according to a report released by Canada's premiers this morning. The analysis, led by Manitoba Premier Greg Selinger, says the Canada Health Transfer will drop by that amount over a 10-year period, starting in 2014-2015, compared to what the provinces now get from Ottawa to help them deliver health services. Selinger and Nova Scotia Premier Darrell Dexter shared the numbers as they headed into the final day of the premiers' summer meeting in Halifax. The new health funding formula, announced abruptly by federal Finance Minister Jim Flaherty in December, means the federal share of health care costs will be 20 per cent by 2024, compared to the 50 per cent share it was originally, the premiers' report says. Flaherty announced that current six per cent annual increases will stay in place through 2017, but by 2018 the increases will drop and be tied to the rate of nominal GDP, which is the measure of economic growth including inflation. The premiers were angry that they were not consulted about the new funding formula and they're still eager to sit down with the federal government. "We remain very committed to the notion of co-operative federalism where there ought to be discussions of these matters before decisions are taken because it does have a big impact on Canadians," Selinger said. "Those resources will mean less money available for nurses and doctors and health care where people live in communities all across the country."

Submit a comment

crista

- July 24, 2012 at 18:05:45

to the professional in the off shore you should be getting the minimum wage for your educated comment,how did you get your foot in the door ???? mr boss man????

Submit a comment

Robin

- July 21, 2012 at 11:50:19

Craig: I can agree somewhat with your comments. Well balanced and well thought out, with acceptable agruements that do have merit. With private ownership of medical equipment, there are extra costs borne on our healthcare dollars such as profits for owner, workers wages, and let's not forget the largest cost, the share holders! If healthcare buys the medical equipment, we only pay for the machine and the workers wages. This can be very advantagious over the long term. To privatize all healthcare will costs us more in the long run *(insurance costs and denial of claims) than to put our tax dollars into healthcare. Thanks for your comment.

Submit a comment

craig

- July 19, 2012 at 13:44:19

Robin I think you are being a bit of an alarmist when it comes to Private Healthcare. There is a difference between Privatized Healthcare like in the US and Publicly Funded and Privately delivered which is already happening in Canada. You can go to blood and xray clinics in Ontario and get service with your OHIP card. Those clinics are privately owned but the public pays the bill. I bet you they do more than twice the number of xrays or blood tests a day than the publicly owned hospital. The same thing goes on here when you go to your family doctor, you have a privately owned clinic charging MCP for your visit. I think that BIG ticket items like Buildings and Infrastructure like MRI machines, PET scanners should be privately owned and the province pay for you to use it. If I owned a MRI clinic I would have that machine running 24 hours a day seven days a week and offer two options, regularly scheduled MRI's paid by the province and optional paid by the patient if they chose....either way we would not have to wait 6 months to get an MRI. I don't have a problem with the Old Age pension age being raised, I will be paying into it for a few more years yet before I ever get a chance to draw if it even exists then. EI...Why should people like me who have been pretty much working steady for the last 20 years keep paying into a system that allows certain people to work for 12 weeks a year and get EI for 40? About time they did something about it. I don't like Harper and would not vote for him but these few changes don't upset me....about time.

Submit a comment

Robin

- July 19, 2012 at 13:06:11

Well I see the educated understand what Universal Healthcare is and how valuable it is to all people. The other "edumacated, intellimagent" people like Cletus believes his taxes will stop if we privatize healthcare. Well, I just hope you don't waste your money on chewing tobacco and grits because that'll give you cancer, healthcare is needed then, or you can use your unregistered gun to cure you ills.

Submit a comment

response to Denis Diderot

- July 19, 2012 at 07:55:14

Yes, I have moved my business offshore to avoid taxes. I still pay taxes, just less taxes. Also, when declaring income in Canada for my offshore operations, I do pay Canadian taxes, lots and lots of Canadian taxes....just in a lesser amount that what I would pay if I operated in Canada. So while your taxes are supporting the services that I use, I am still a taxpayer and pay over 7 figures in corporate taxes each year. So make no mistake, even though I offshore jobs to pay less taxes, I still pay lots of taxes....likely more that my fair share. I also donate to the charities of my choice to avoid taxes. You quoted part of my sentence where I did concede that employees are important, but you conveniently left out the most important part - where I say that unskilled uneducated workers are not worth retaining. Basically, I am happy to pay a worker a livable wage so long as they make a meaningful contribution, but it is my opinion that an unskilled uneducated person should never earn more than minimum wage, and I as an employer will not pay it. If an unskilled uneducated employee wants more than minimum wage, then they need a different employer. IN short, unskilled uneducated workers bring nothing to the table that warrants more than the minimum wage. These workers do contribute to profits, but not in a way that makes it important to retain them....as does the engineer, the IT person, or the accountant. The unskilled uneducated worker can be easily replaced, so as an employer, it would be foolish for me to give that worker more when the next unskilled uneducated worker can do the same work for minimum wage. So in short, even as I make record profits, I will never ever ever pay an unskilled uneducated worker more than the minimum wage simply because I don't have to. If they don't like the wage, they can leave. And lastly, I have no interest in the health or retirement funding of my unskilled workers. I only care about them during the hours that they work for me....outside of that, I want nothing to do with them. For my engineers, accountants, and other skilled employees, I must give wage increases, company cars, expense accounts, pensions, benefits, paid vacations, access to company condo(s).....these employees are important and play an important role, unlike the unskilled uneducated worker.

Submit a comment

Petertwo

- July 19, 2012 at 04:55:33

Yes David, we must'nt let a few facts let us get in the way of your propaganda, must we. Do you have actually anything to back up your comments other than a lot of verbiage? Services are being reduced but I do not remember seeing anywhere that government are reducing taxes, except maybe for corporations. Assuming that governments will reduce taxes will not make it so.

Submit a comment

Edward Sawdon

- July 18, 2012 at 20:12:34

It seems that Wild Rose and the anonymous business man seem to dislike our Public Medicare system, and feel that they are "Taxed to death!" Well your opinion may be shared by a few but the vast majority of Canadians like our universal Public Medicare system. Yes our system isn't perfect but I would find our system much much better than the American system. Like Wild Rose and this "Business man" I am a Taxpayer too! And, I don't mind paying my fair share of taxes so people like Wild Rose and the Business man can have access to our country's public medicare system if they medically need it. Do these individuals feel better by paying high private insurance premiums than by paying taxes. What do these two people propose? Privatized our entire medicare system, and force millions of people off our Public Health Insurance system? Do they think Canada and Newfoundland & Labrador have a healthy workforce if people are cut off their public medical system? Do these people really really realize that some day in the future they or people like them are one paycheck or one illness away from POVERTY, Bankruptcy and Chronic Illnesses or Disability? Do they really care if their neighbours or friends or other Canadians have access to good quality health care? Are they proposing to have a "Survival of the Fitess Society? Don't we as a civilized society have a moral and spiritual obligation to arise from our own selfvested interests and help one another?

Submit a comment

Cletus the slack-jaw yokel

- July 17, 2012 at 09:22:56

@ Anon. I Ain't stupid. I done voted Tory and now I don't gotta register my shootin' gun. An' iffin they privitize health care I won't haveta pay taxes an' I ain't neveer gonna get sick.

Submit a comment

Peter

- July 17, 2012 at 08:51:21

With privatised health care in the USA the average American family is living one step away from bankruptcy, one serious illness or injury could wipe them out with costs NOT covered by their insurer. Insurers do not like paying out, be careful what you wish for. The high taxes are a result of poor government management. They had, or should have had, the control over their own expenditures, but votes count for everything.

Submit a comment

Taylor

- July 17, 2012 at 00:14:32

Your predictions were wrong on all accounts, Robin. Health care funding has certainly NOT been "cut way back." It is still increasing by a staggering 6% per year until 2017, and will then continue to increase by a minimum of 3% per year. As for employment insurance, collecting is NOT "harder." The criteria to collect EI are exactly the same as before, a new permanent formula will base benefits on the recipient's best 14 weeks of income in high unemployment areas, and recipients can work while on claim without losing all their earnings. As for Old Age Security, it is a waste. It is not targeted toward low-income seniors. Any senior with less than $112,000.00 in annual income can collect OAS, which is absurd. All of these programs - health care, EI and OAS - suffer from bloated budgets and should be cut. But sadly that is not what is happening.

Submit a comment

• 

  David

  - July 17, 2012 at 12:56:42

  Ah, the Great Lie propogated by 'the machine' that keeps ignorant Canucks properly fearful and grateful enough to continue toeing the line.....well done! Ask yourself this: if so many Americans are so blatantly and dangerously close to financial ruin, why didn't they do something about it long ago? Why don't they all embrace Obamacare now? Doesn't fit your "little story" too well, does it!?

• 

  David

  - July 17, 2012 at 13:21:30

  My post was a response to Peter, one above this......not to Taylor.

Anon

- July 16, 2012 at 21:36:33

The Canadian people are too stupid to know what they're supporting and too lazy to educate themselves. This country is dead already. There is no future for our children. We had a good run for it but this is the end I'm afraid.

Submit a comment

Private All The Way

- July 16, 2012 at 17:21:52

Can't wait for private health care! If there is competition amoung clinics, we will get faster and better care. When health care goes private, government will have to cut taxes because taxes wil no longer be covering health care. The money we save on taxes wil be spent on private health care insurance. So, there is no change in the amount coming out of people's walets while geting beter quality care! When you have to wait weeks to see a GP and months to see a specialist, you know the current system is a gonner.

Submit a comment

• 

  Ayn Rand

  - July 17, 2012 at 15:20:41

  If that were true the US government wouldn't be spending more per capita on health care then Canada.

Wild Rose

- July 16, 2012 at 14:54:13

All I'ms saying is that my tax money is going to pay for a bumch of welfare cases and immigrants who come here and do nothing then go to the doctor with the sniffles while those of us who can afford it have to wait in line. Some places have started the ball rolling. its called progress. WEe are bankrupt because of al these entitglements and those of who work hard are being taxed to death. I got the moneybecause I work hard and employ people and I'm sick of paying thier pensions. We have to start cutting back becaus of the billions we spend on people sitting at home drinking beer and the immigrants who take our jobs and the union bosses. I have never took NOTHING from the government and I never will.

Submit a comment

• 

  JK

  - July 16, 2012 at 15:56:43

  "I have never took nothing from the government" Ever driven on a paved road? Called the cops? Had a glass of tap water? Gone to school from grades K to 12? Sat in a doctor's office? You sound like someone who got rich doing a trade out west and let it go to their head. Trust me, you're no better than the "welfare cases" and "immigrants".

• 

  Chantal

  - July 16, 2012 at 18:52:47

  @JK Right on! Although, judging from his writing, I would venture to guess that he never did partake of the K to 12 schooling.

• 

  a business man

  - July 17, 2012 at 08:03:33

  Hey Wild Rose....if you are sick of paying for people's pensions in Canada, move your company our of the country and take your money out of the system. I am so sick of being taxed to death in Canada, and paying for the benefits of other people. When I move jobs out of Canada, I pay less in tax and put more money in my pocket. I suggest that you take a close look at your business and offshore anything and everything that can be done my an unskilled uneducated worker. AT this say and age, no business should be paying an unskilled uneducated worker any more than minimum wage unless the job physically cannot be done elsewhere (resource extraction for example). Make no mistake, employees are important. One must pay employees such as engineers, accountants, lawyers and executives very well in order to retain the employee. But there is no reason why an unskilled uneducated worker has to be retained...they bring nothing to the table that cannot be easily replaced. So if you are sick of paying for other people's pensions in Canada, offshore as many jobs as you can.....you may end up still paying for other people's pension in the USA or China, but you will be paying less overall, so that mean more money in your pocket.

• 

  Denis Diderot

  - July 18, 2012 at 15:04:29

  'A Business Man', so you have moved your company off shore to avoid taxes and I assume ideally you would like to avoid paying taxes altogether? Which would mean if you still live in Canada my taxes would be going to support you? That seems fair. 'Make no mistake, employees are important.', yeah you can say that again. Employees are the ones creating your wealth not the other way around. How dare people ask for a decent wage or god forbid a pension, while they make you rich. You undertand that all value and cost and profits are created through labor right?

David

- July 16, 2012 at 13:51:48

To recap: "....Harper got a majority government.....So, what did happen next?.....health care was deemed to be a provincial problem...." Robin, your basic understanding of this issue is truly stunning.

Submit a comment

Its not so bad

- July 16, 2012 at 13:39:34

Is public really better? That's a matter of opinion I guess. I'm all for privatizing GPs. Under our system we have tens of thousands of people that cannot get a family doctor.

Submit a comment

Robin

- July 16, 2012 at 13:31:06

David: It is only unsustainable if we let it be. If there is one thing I want my taxes to be used for it's healthcare. Everyone needs healthcare. And my article was Crystal Ball Revised, the Telegram changed it. But it was meant to show what I had observed 2 years ago and what has happened since then. Thanks for your comments everyone.

Submit a comment

• 

  David

  - July 16, 2012 at 17:06:18

  Re: your first sentence......are you posting this from 1975 using some time machine texhnology? I've got some really, REALLY bad news for you.....

David

- July 16, 2012 at 12:37:41

The "next" shoe to drop? Really?! Robin, you must have been soundly asleep for quite some time, Rip Van Winkle-like actually, to have missed the racket that all those 'health care' shoes being dropped over the past couple of decades have made. There is no universal health care, my dear...I guess we're each just going to figure that out one by one when it's our own turn. It's bankrupt ---- they're just straightening the deck chairs on the Titanic.

Submit a comment

Robin Brentnall

- July 16, 2012 at 12:37:38

Wild Rose: Will you qualify for privatized healthcare? Or will your "Pre-Existing Conditions" disqualify you and cause you to have to pay cash for your surgery or doctor's visit? Roy: The amount that people pay for non-public healthcare insurance could be reduced to a very small tax to increase public funding for dental and eye glasses, etc. We don't realize how little it takes when everyone pays an extra dollar per month to get those things. Blue Cross is over $20 per month. Public would run about $1-2 per month. But the real winners with private healthcare is the insurance companies, and if you look at the USA and their system, you would never want that.

Submit a comment

wild rose

- July 16, 2012 at 11:39:43

And I say good. Why should I pay for the welfare crowd and immigrants with my hard earned tax dollars! Carry on Harper.

Submit a comment

Roy

- July 16, 2012 at 09:55:40

You predicted it just like everyone else. Privatized healthcare already exists, at least for those that can afford to fly off to other provinces or the US. Some parts of our health care already have some type of privatization such as in dental and eye care. Why not look at opening more of our health care to privatization. Now don't fly off your rocker. I don't mean throwing the whole thing wide open. But what about privatizing some of the services such as MRIs.

Submit a comment